`<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Jul 7, 2017 at 10:24 AM, Peter Tribble <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:peter.tribble@gmail.com" target="_blank">peter.tribble@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote"><span class="">On Fri, Jul 7, 2017 at 12:47 AM, Aurélien Larcher <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:aurelien.larcher@gmail.com" target="_blank">aurelien.larcher@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><span></span><div>It is good news, but I would engage you to discuss about reducing the fragmentation in the illumos community.<br></div><div>We have a few distros maintained by 1-3 guys without any or much momentum and much duplication of efforts (Debian has 1000+ devs working together and we are barely able to have more than 10).<br></div><div><br></div><div>We should join our efforts like, as I suggested, basing on common tools and userland.<br>I do not see how wasting energy in duplicate efforts will help us keep/gain momentum.<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span><div>I don't actually see significant duplication of effort. In the case of OI<br></div><div>and OmniOS, there's not much overlap because the work is in<br></div><div>completely separate areas.<br></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Not much overlap as in server use? <br></div></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div> <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><div>Each community or distro does work that largely falls into 2 categories:<br></div><div>work that's only relevant to that community, or work that, because it's<br>all open source and published, can easily be picked up by someone else.</div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>How about lowering the barrier to make "easily" easier?<br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div></div><span class=""><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div></div><div>I mentioned earlier the possibility of a virtuous circle with OI as the rolling testing and OmniOS the stable: to be honest I see very little sense in maintaining two "testing" with such a small manpower. In the long term this does not seem sustainable.<br></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div></span><div>Attempting to coerce 2 projects together is even worse; each is then<br>compromised by having to work not only to its own rules and schedule<br></div><div>but has to fit in with the other project too.<br><br></div><div>You have the relationship between OI and OmniOS inverted, I think.<br>The only merge I can see making sense is for OI to rebase on<br>illumos-omnios rather than illumos-gate - in which case OI is a downstream<br></div><div>derivative of OmniOS.<br></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Interesting<br></div><div> <br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><div>(The situation of OmniOS being the "stable" branch of OI is unlikely to<br></div><div>work. Apart from the philosophical and technical incompatibilities, it's<br></div><div>relatively easy to have an unstable/testing branch of a stable project,<br></div><div>but it's hard to take a rolling testing project and build a stable project<br></div><div>on top of it. Besides, that would require OI to do an awful lot of work<br></div><div>in terms of backporting/release engineering/testing and the like that<br></div><div>isn't directly relevant to them which would then have to be duplicated<br></div><div>downstream as well.)<br></div></div><br></div><div class="gmail_extra">Generally, if you have mature intelligent people forming communities<br>they will naturally form reasonably optimal structures. People tend to<br>make choices that make it easier for them to make progress. (Yes, it's<br>a local maximum rather than a global one.) Telling people what they<br></div><div class="gmail_extra">ought to do tends not to be well received; if you want to change the<br></div><div class="gmail_extra">behaviour of people or the structure then you need to game the system<br></div><div class="gmail_extra">to give people better options than the one they've currently chosen.<br></div></div></blockquote><br>Being too enthusiastic can be interpreted in a negative way.<br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><div><br></div><div class="gmail_quote">Discussing the possibilities seems is indeed unreasonable since coercion should be avoided at all cost and most likely nothing will work out. You are right, sorry for the disturbance.<br><br></div></div><div class="gmail_quote">Let us move along in the saddle point.<br></div><div class="gmail_quote">Kind regards,<br><br></div><div class="gmail_quote">Aurélien<br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra">Cheers,<span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><br><br></font></span></div><span class="HOEnZb"><font color="#888888"><div class="gmail_extra">-- <br><div class="m_8408414962683379430gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature">-Peter Tribble<br><a href="http://www.petertribble.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://www.petertribble.co.uk/</a> - <a href="http://ptribble.blogspot.com/" target="_blank">http://ptribble.blogspot.com/</a></div>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><font style="font-family:courier new,monospace" size="1">---<br>Praise the Caffeine embeddings<br></font></div></div></div></div>
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